Harry Potter and the Muggle Prime Minister (Ch 1 Minor Spoiler)
#1
I've seen various attempts to align the timeline of the Harry Potter books (where each book is ne year after the previous one) and those of our "real" world (where there are several year gaps between books).
Up to now this has been academic. But while reading Ch 1 of the new book, I kept wondering about Fudge's appointment with the Muggle Prime Minister, undoubtedly Mr. Blair. Or was it John Major?
It ahs to be him on either timeline: He became PM in 1997, the same year as Harry Potter and the Philosopher's/Sorceror's Stone was published. If we assume that the book took place that year, then TB is the PM and the "book" year is 2003.
However, nothing HP&P/SS says that it took place the year of its appearance.
OTOH, I've seen various sites saying that Book 1 took place in 1991-2 - making this one 1997, and Mr. Blair is fresh in office.
This can't be, because the chapter relates several previous conversations the PM has had with Fudge. The first is a mere "getting acquaited" chat, occuring shortly after the PM is elected (if Blair, 1997; if John Major, 1990).
The second occured 3 years ago in book time, when Fudge told the PM about the escape of "Serious" Black from Azkaban. We aren't told how long after the PM's election this second interview occurred, only that it was three years ago.
The only other evidence I find is Fudge's comment during that first chat:
Quote:"And I must say, you're taking it a lot better than your predecessor. He tried to throw me out the window, thought I was a hoax planted by the opposition."
John Major's predecessor was Margaret Thatcher, decidedly not a he, though (seems to me) far more likely to chuck someone like Fudge out the window than the more sedate Major. (And, IIRC, Major, like Thatcher, was of the Conservative Party, and stepped into office upon Thatcher's resignation. The text clearly says the PM won an election.
Case proved, the PM is Blair, and the year is at least 2003.

Unless this is not our universe at all...
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#2
definatley blair
Quote:then three years ago
H-BP page 13 start of paragraph 2
Blair was in office three years ago
Shorey for England!
Reading fans


RoCk On SnOw PaTrOl

- Kwik Silva 44
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#3
i dont think it is a book that is ment to be seriously related to the non-book world.. its simply a story.. i doubt that jkr actually had dates in her head. she doesnt name the pm for a reason.. i would think that it is because she doesnt want people to be doing what ur doing.. the lack of name makes the stories able to take place over more than just a few years.. perhaps 50 yrs from now, these books will still make sense..
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#4
we can still debate about it cant we?
Shorey for England!
Reading fans


RoCk On SnOw PaTrOl

- Kwik Silva 44
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#5
Why do the characters in the books have to be related to our world?
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#6
Michael asks
Quote:Why do the characters in the books have to be related to our world?

A couple of reasons occur:
1. The image of Blair and Fudge together struck me as pretty hilarious.
2. If my chronology is right, then much of the previous struggle with Voldemort occurred on Maggie Thatcher's watch. Surely Fudge's predecessor briefed her on that struggle. Again the mind boggles. At the very least, MT wouldn't have put up with circumlocutions like "he who must not be named."
3. On another front, most of us are aware of Arthur C. Clarke's 3rd law:
Quote:Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Web have some pretty advanced technology these days that when it works seems magical (and when it doesn't, might imply poltergeists.) Yet the muggle technology Arthur Weasley is infatuated with seems decidedly low-tech.
4. I'd especially be interested in the magic community's take on the fact that muggles have been to the moon.
5. I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. We have more than our share of oddballs. If HP is atking place app. now, it may explain a lot.
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#7
Gildor Inglorion Wrote:I've seen various attempts to align the timeline of the Harry Potter books (where each book is ne year after the previous one) and those of our "real" world (where there are several year gaps between books).
Up to now this has been academic. But while reading Ch 1 of the new book, I kept wondering about Fudge's appointment with the Muggle Prime Minister, undoubtedly Mr. Blair. Or was it John Major?
It ahs to be him on either timeline: He became PM in 1997, the same year as Harry Potter and the Philosopher's/Sorceror's Stone was published. If we assume that the book took place that year, then TB is the PM and the "book" year is 2003.
However, nothing HP&P/SS says that it took place the year of its appearance.
OTOH, I've seen various sites saying that Book 1 took place in 1991-2 - making this one 1997, and Mr. Blair is fresh in office.
This can't be, because the chapter relates several previous conversations the PM has had with Fudge. The first is a mere "getting acquaited" chat, occuring shortly after the PM is elected (if Blair, 1997; if John Major, 1990).
The second occured 3 years ago in book time, when Fudge told the PM about the escape of "Serious" Black from Azkaban. We aren't told how long after the PM's election this second interview occurred, only that it was three years ago.
The only other evidence I find is Fudge's comment during that first chat:
John Major's predecessor was Margaret Thatcher, decidedly not a he, though (seems to me) far more likely to chuck someone like Fudge out the window than the more sedate Major. (And, IIRC, Major, like Thatcher, was of the Conservative Party, and stepped into office upon Thatcher's resignation. The text clearly says the PM won an election.
Case proved, the PM is Blair, and the year is at least 2003.

Unless this is not our universe at all...

The year the books start in is indeed 1991. In the second book, instead of going to the Halloween party, Harry, Ron, and Hernione go to Nearly Headless Nick's 500th deathday party. At the party, on his cake, it is written that he died on October 31, 1492. Therefore, the present year would be 1992, which implies the books start in 1991.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."- Abraham Lincoln
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#8
But what is the purpose of this chapter?? I can't see a reason for it. (except to introduce the Muggle PM as having always known about the wizard world and to introduce Scrimgour)
Happy:daisy:
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#9
The reason why J.K.Rowling chose to include this chapter was in my opinion a simple way of reminding us in a few pages what has happened over the last three years :Sirius Black, Voldemot's return and the mass breakout from Azkaban. Of course we know all those things but as you may have noticed the author usually gives information about the old characters even H.P. so that anyone can start reading any book.Moreover, J.K. wanted to show that Voldemort has wreaked havoc even in the Muggle world. Besides, in the 3rd book Fudge mentions that the Prime Minister is aware of Sirius Black and then we start wondering whether the P.M. knows about witches and wizards. So Rowling had to fill that blank in.
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#10
I'm not completely convinced it's just to go over past events. This also could have been done in many ways. But JKR has never gone so far into the muggle world (with the exclusion of Privet Drive) that includes people of significance in the "REAL" world. She never does anything without a good reason and I just don't think that covering past events is a strong enough reason. The whole paragraph lead to there being some invlovement of said prime minister, but we never saw it. Maybe in the next book...
Happy:daisy:
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#11
Perhaps you may be right.
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#12
I think J.K. Rowling is setting the stage or Voldemort's direct entry into Muggle affairs in Book VII. After all, if Harry doesn't return to Hogwarts, then Hogwarts will no longer be the central setting for the storyline. And Voldemort had started to make attacks against the Muggle world the first time around.

Voldemort's plan seems to be to do something to the Muggle world. The question is, does he want to conquer it, destroy it, or just somehow reduce it to a lesser status?
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#13
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#14
good piont as she did not mention the president he was expeceting a call off ,she just said a president of a distant country
STAR WARS RULES!!!!!!!!!
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#15
I don't think JKR meant for the Prime Minister in the book to be one of the real Prime Ministers. She probably just made one up. Although that is a pretty funny thought... Tony Blair and Fudge... :laugh:

And like others have said, the point of the chapter was really to show us that there's an increasing necessity for unity between the Wizarding and Muggle worlds. And, in addition, that the war Voldemort is waging is beginning to have effects on the Muggles.
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#16
its not funny, it fits, anyway, i think that she called him the primeminister so we dont have this convosation!
Shorey for England!
Reading fans


RoCk On SnOw PaTrOl

- Kwik Silva 44
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#17
Harry Potter is just a book, it isn't the real world. I don't think JK Rowling meant the PM in Chapter 1 to be Blair. The Muggle Prime Minister is just a character, he's not a real person...
Anyway, I don't think it really matters if the PM in Book 6 is Blair or not.
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