Casablanca Discussion
#1
This is answer to some thoughts and discussion brought up on another thread.

Quote:Originally posted by Lady Eowyn
And you are correct, Robroy, I have never loved two people at once so I can never fully understand how hard it is to choose one over the other. I am a firm believer that there is one person out there for me (whom I have yet to meet) and I suppose that is why I find love triangles so annoying.

I wish you luck with that, then. I won't dispute your belief except to say that my experience states differently. Or at least it says that in picking one person over all others, you're bound to hurt someone.

But, the true tragedy of Rick and Ilsa's love for each other is summed up by Rick when he says, "I'm saying it because it's true. Inside us we both know you belong with Victor. You're part of his work, the thing that keeps him going. If that plane leaves and you're not on it, you'll regret it."

Rick and Ilsa choose not for themselves, but for the greater good. If you can't imagine chosing between two people you love deeply, imagine chosing between one man you do love, and one man who could help thousands, maybe millions.

Quote:I love famous movie quotes but the Casablanca quote, "Louis, I think this is the start of a beautiful friendship" I bit random.

It's actually an excellent summation of the entire movie. Louis and Rick weren't friends at the start of the film. Acquaintances, business associates, players of the same games, certain. But not friends. It is in the final act of the movie where Rick reveals his true character (and you're quite right that Rick was "fake", he'd built a facade around himself to keep himself from being hurt again), his ability to see beyond his own self-interests and his own personal happiness that Louis really sees him. Louis, in turn, grows at this point as well, chosing, to side with Rick, and to flee with him from Casablanca. This reveals, in turn, that Louis is also not what he would have everyone, including Rick, believe.

So both men have changed over the course of the events that took place in the space of a few days, and are not on a level where friendship can actually begin, in the midst of war and running for their lives.
All your base are belong to us.

It could be that the purpose of my life is only to serve as a warning to others.
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#2
I'll add my two cents' worth here, including some responses to observations in the other thread.

First - I think something can be romantic, and yet not end happily. Doomed romances are often what makes for good stories.

On Ilsa being able to start over - we've gotta remember - she was supposed to be *young* - ten years before, she was wearing braces, remember. We don't know how long she was married to Victor - maybe not even a year. Different people react to grief in different ways. Paul McCartney married the love of his life... and yet remarried only a few years later. Grief for the loss of a great love doesn't necessarily destroy the capacity to love. Plus, I always got the impression that her love for Victor was as much or more admiration as passion. In her early 20's, she seems to have a tendency to be attracted to charismatic men in their 40's. She might have been 16 when she married him, for that matter, in a fit of puppy love. Smile

The line "Here's lookin' at you kid" means to me that it's just something sort of silly, and cutesy, and has meaning for Rick and Ilsa. Bogey's a tough guy - he's not going to say "I wuv u, my sweet baboo." :bounce:


To me, "Casablanca" has always been greater than the sum of its parts. It was a stage play originally, and yet manages to avoid the claustrophobia that its interior sets (even the airport is faked) might imply. It was budgeted to be a B-movie at best, and Bogey was still not exactly Clark Gable at this stage. "Maltese Falcon" just turned out to be an unexpected hit, so they transferred over as many of its cast as they could.

The basic scenes - parted lovers re-encounter each other unexpectedly.... several situations of girls willing to sleep with guys in order to save their husbands.... conflicting groups face off in a bar.... cynical and jaded guy has to take a stand..... these had all been done to death even by the 1940's. Something clicks in this one though - maybe Bogart was reaching back into his stage roots.... maybe director Curtiz, without cavalry charges and shipwrecks to direct, spent some more time with his actors...maybe everyone was simply cast in roles they really liked..... but some of the most powerful scenes have little to do with the plot or the script. Like the famous "Times Go By" scene in the bar - whether it's the facial expressions of Bogart and Bergman, or the eidting back and forth between them, or whatever - it still works. Ditto for Laszlo leading the bar patrons in "Le Marseillaise." Cut those scenes out, and the plot is still the same - and yet we remember the raw emotions they tap into.

As for the closing line with Rick and Renault - again, Rick is a tough guy - so he's unlikely to say "It's highly gratifying to see you reach your highest level of self-actualization; I commend you for your change of heart, and look forward to working with you as an ally and comrade in arms." :laugh: It's just a cute one-liner, designed to close out the movie, and put a half-smile on the faces of everyone bawling their eyes out. Smile
August  - Jack's Pack Fan # 1, Keeper of the List, 3-Time Speaker of the JoAT Fan Quote of the Week, and the only person ever to have Back 2 Back Jack and Cleo fan quotes !
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#3
Quote:Originally posted by august
I'll add my two cents' worth here, including some responses to observations in the other thread.

Nice analysis august. One comment (in support of yours):

Quote:On Ilsa being able to start over - we've gotta remember - she was supposed to be *young* - ten years before, she was wearing braces, remember. We don't know how long she was married to Victor - maybe not even a year. Different people react to grief in different ways. Paul McCartney married the love of his life... and yet remarried only a few years later. Grief for the loss of a great love doesn't necessarily destroy the capacity to love. Plus, I always got the impression that her love for Victor was as much or more admiration as passion. In her early 20's, she seems to have a tendency to be attracted to charismatic men in their 40's. She might have been 16 when she married him, for that matter, in a fit of puppy love. Smile

Psychologists state, for the most part, that those who fall in love, and lose that loved one, are likely to fall in love again, regardless of if they married and lived a long and satisfying life with thier "love". This is a theme that is repeated in any number of movies, like Return to Me and most famously Sleepless in Seattle.
All your base are belong to us.

It could be that the purpose of my life is only to serve as a warning to others.
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