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The Nature of Middle-Earth - Printable Version

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The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - September 7th, 2021

Anyone got the book?  What're your thoughts?


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - September 9th, 2021

I usually buy these books as soon as they come out, but I decided to put it off this time as I have a great deal of work to do. I'll probably get the book in a couple of months.

I suspect that some people will extract ideas from it that conflict with other texts and stir up confusion among fans. These kinds of essays tend to be very experimental. Tolkien never really finished tweaking his fiction.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - September 9th, 2021

(September 9th, 2021, 01:21 AM)Michael Wrote: I usually buy these books as soon as they come out, but I decided to put it off this time as I have a great deal of work to do. I'll probably get the book in a couple of months.

I suspect that some people will extract ideas from it that conflict with other texts and stir up confusion among fans. These kinds of essays tend to be very experimental. Tolkien never really finished tweaking his fiction.

Even so, it'll be good to see more of what Tolkien had in mind.  The truth will sift through the confusion.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - September 11th, 2021

I'm probably just being paranoid again. It's what people pay me to be, to be honest. I'm sure I'll enjoy reading the book when I have time, and probably commenting on it here and on my blog.

I hope everyone enjoys it. We've waited a long time for it.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - September 11th, 2021

If you don't mind, some spoiler talk about what I've heard about.
To view, use your mouse to select the text:
Apparently Tolkien toyed with the idea of Galadriel being Celeborn's second wife and step-mother of Amroth (apparently Celeborn's wife left him).  Also Númenórean bears that have an annual dance.



RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - September 19th, 2021

I'm not sure how far those ideas will float with fans. The book may delve into too many obscure ideas for the general audience.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - September 21st, 2021

(September 19th, 2021, 07:39 PM)Michael Wrote: I'm not sure how far those ideas will float with fans. The book may delve into too many obscure ideas for the general audience.

lol Well, I think it's always fun to see the thought process.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - September 21st, 2021

It is fun. And it's fun to speculate. I probably sound a bit more drab about the book than I should, but I've been working a lot of hours lately and it's hard for me to be energetic right now.

I'm fully looking forward to reading the book. I have deferred buying it because I don't want to start reading it and then have to stop in the middle.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - September 24th, 2021

(September 21st, 2021, 10:00 PM)Michael Wrote: It is fun. And it's fun to speculate. I probably sound a bit more drab about the book than I should, but I've been working a lot of hours lately and it's hard for me to be energetic right now.

I'm fully looking forward to reading the book. I have deferred buying it because I don't want to start reading it and then have to stop in the middle.

Totally understandable.  I just bought my copy today.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - October 1st, 2021

(September 21st, 2021, 10:00 PM)Michael Wrote: I'm fully looking forward to reading the book. I have deferred buying it because I don't want to start reading it and then have to stop in the middle.

*snort* You're going to have fun when you get to Ingwë, Finwë, and Elwë's geneology.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - October 6th, 2021

Is that one of the "here's a couple of paragraphs" sections or one of the longer pieces?


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - ZehnWaters - October 6th, 2021

(October 6th, 2021, 11:16 AM)Michael Wrote: Is that one of the "here's a couple of paragraphs" sections or one of the longer pieces?

It's a section of a longer piece.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - bilbobaggins764 - October 7th, 2021

(September 7th, 2021, 08:26 PM)ZehnWaters Wrote: Anyone got the book?  What're your thoughts?

Just finished it a few weeks back. I place it with the other official HOME. I would recommend it to any who enjoyed the HOME.

(September 11th, 2021, 12:08 AM)Michael Wrote: I'm probably just being paranoid again. It's what people pay me to be, to be honest. I'm sure I'll enjoy reading the book when I have time, and probably commenting on it here and on my blog.

I hope everyone enjoys it. We've waited a long time for it.

I also suffered from paranoia when I was informed that a "new" HOME was being released by someone not named Christopher. I thought, why would Christopher not have published this material at some point? Why is it only after his death we get a new one? But after reading it I can put your fears to rest. The editorial content is very limited, and it amounts to various writings of Tolkien's as he thought about many aspects of his works. It is not so much "new" material in history, but speculative metaphysical thought and other random assorted ideas about ME. Very little if any is "finished" or likely intended for publication by Tolkien. I think it just helped him underhand his world better.

(September 19th, 2021, 07:39 PM)Michael Wrote: I'm not sure how far those ideas will float with fans. The book may delve into too many obscure ideas for the general audience.


This is spot on. I think many who read the entire HOME will still skip thought sections of nature.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Tar-Elenion - February 21st, 2022

The variety of attempts Tolkien went through in regards to what he seems to have desired the Elven birth and aging process to be, and to make it line up with the Tale of Years and certain dates that could not feasibly be changed are an interesting, if complex, read.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Tar-Elenion - March 1st, 2022

This is one interesting bit (among many) in NoMe:
"The Eldar of Ossiriand, the Green Elves, though wood-dwellers, were of quite different origin [to the Wood-elves/Silvan Elves of TH and LotR], which does not here concern us; they were probably in origin of Noldorin kinship."
NoMe 3-XVII, Silvan Elves and Silvan Elvish
Hostetter notes the text this is in, is "closely associated" with The Disaster of the Gladden Fields and The History of Galadriel and Celeborn in UT.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - March 2nd, 2022

That Tatyarin (Noldorin) origin of the Green-Elves of Ossiriand was published prior to this book coming out. I'm not sure if I read it in one of the HoME volumes or in something from Vinyar Tengwar. If the latter, it may be the same text (or closely related) to what's published in NoME.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Tar-Elenion - March 2nd, 2022

You are probably thinking of this:
"The first Avari that the Eldar met again in Beleriand seem to have claimed to be Tatyar, who acknowledged their kinship with the Exiles, though there is no record of their using the name Noldo in any recognizable Avarin form. They were actually unfriendly to the Noldor, and jealous of their more exalted kin, whom they accused of arrogance."
WotJ, Q&E, C, The Clan Names
But they are still Telerin Nandor in Q&E, and, having set on the Great March, would not be Avari.
Tolkien seems to have moved away from there being any Avari in Beleriand.

While my memory is not as good as it used to be, I recall nothing like that in VT, and an admittedly quick glance through VT 39 (with Q&E material) turns nothing up.

Have you read NoMe yet?


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - March 2nd, 2022

So, I would guess both these texts are from a similar time-frame in Tolkien's career.

I wish I had time to read the book. I've just been swamped with too much work and too many personal projects. Also, I've used my spare time to binge-watch shows (some of which I've written about in the forums) for relaxation.


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Tar-Elenion - March 2nd, 2022

Quendi and Eldar is from ca. 1959-60. The Silvan Elves texts (which have the Laiquendi of Noldorin kinship) are from ca. 1968.

Well, hopefully you will get a chance at it.
=====

Anyone else here read it?


RE: The Nature of Middle-Earth - Michael - March 2nd, 2022

Looks like I'll need to make time for it this year! LOL!

Thanks for the dates.